LemonWedge 470 build thread

[dvw]

First I'm not a machinist. I'm a guy who builds his own stuff. Though I've studied with some pretty sharp mentors through out the years. It would be wise to make sure the bearing bores are in the correct range of dimension. I would bet most machine shops have a better dial bore gauge than any of us own. For sure your measurements show the dimension on the crank is on the high side of spec. I'd have your machine shop measure both items. Now the fix? Can the crank be polished and stay round w/o taper? Can the bearing bores be opened enough to make a difference and still be in spec? What if the answers to these questions are no? Two options. Run it as is. Or turn the mains down to -.020" on the low side of the spec. To be honest it looks like a canidate to run thin oil and leave it alone.
Doug

 

[Fran Blacker]

Would there be any help to run babbit main bearings?

 

[Gunner1]

Just a thought. If you have a torch and a rosebud tip. The block and crank expand at different rates. You could try a before and after by heating each up to your oil temp you run. Say 200f. Check housing bore and main size. It may expand enough to make a difference. i use to hone the saddles then let them sit for a bit to cool. Just the hot oil and stone abrasion would change the bore size by a few tenths. Your close. And it’s easier to hone a couple in the saddles than use a polish machine on a crank.

 

[LemonWedge]

In my best Emily Litella voice……. NEVER MIND.

Sometimes what any task needs is a fresh look. I realized I had a few things wrong on my initial look. First: my bore dial guage was not being used properly. I put it in my mic and realized my assumption of ”zero” was off by .018. Next, I realized I wasn’t doing the math correctly. Bottom line, this tool and this task just may be smarter than I am.

So this afternoon, I went out and started with a fresh head. I simplified the task by setting my mic at my target dimension of 2.6185 (which would be .003 outside of the crank journal of 2.6155). Then I put the bore guage in the mic and zero‘d it at that dimension. I then took the bore guage to the mocked up journal, and what do you know….. it came up at ZERO. So I am at .0030 clearance on the money (which happens to be exactly what my machinist said he would shoot for). I’ll now go through the exercise with the other journals

I thank you all for your patience.

update: All journals consistent within .0005. We’re good to go on the mains.

 

[biomedtechguy]

To be honest it looks like a canidate to run thin oil and leave it alone.

I don't know squat, but that's exactly what I thought immediately after reading his post about tight bearing clearance, well, using light weight oil and making a joke about having great oil pressure...

 

[dvw]

Measuring acurately is an aquired talent. At first getting repeatable numbers is difficult. Funny story. I took a block to my friend Phil. The bores were barrel shaped by .002". I asked how much would need to be removed to get them straight. He said .0002" larger than the .002". Through it in the hone with a plate . He proceded to hit it a few times adjusting the hone stroke. Then after it cools he whips the dial bore in it in. Goes up/down, turns it 90 goes up/down. The measurement process takes about 10 swconds , max. I said "how the hell did you even read the gauge?" He says "come here rookie" Slowly moves the gauge up/down then 90 up/down. It's spot on .0022"
Doug

 

[LemonWedge]

Main Journal measurement video:

 

[padam]

Good idea on the video. Glad you got it figured out. But you have “three thousands “ clearance. That’s “ thirty ten thousands.”

 

[LemonWedge]

Good idea on the video. Glad you got it figured out. But you have “three thousands “ clearance. That’s “ thirty ten thousands.”

well that makes a ton of sense…. I keep looking at the dimension and saying to myself “do I have the right number of zero’s in there?” . 30-ten/thousandths is exactly what it looks like.

Learn something every day my dad always told me.

This weekend I’ll turn my attention to rod journals, and hopefully get the block and some components painted while I wait for the pistons to return.

Any good tips on engine painting?

 

[padam]

well that makes a ton of sense…. I keep looking at the dimension and saying to myself “do I have the right number of zero’s in there?” . 30-ten/thousandths is exactly what it looks like.

Learn something every day my dad always told me.

This weekend I’ll turn my attention to rod journals, and hopefully get the block and some components painted while I wait for the pistons to return.

Any good tips on engine painting?

As long as the numbers are right that’s what counts.
It’s just that it is common for machinists to talk in terms of “thousandths ” or “thousands”.
.001 is “one thousandth”
.050 is “fifty thousandths”
Then when things get close,
.0001 is “a tenth” short for one ten thousandth.
.0005 is “5 tenths”
And lest we get confused;
I know .100 is a tenth, but most machinists will say “ a hundred thousandths.”

 

[Fran Blacker]

Making a video and getting the decimal mixed easy. Like following LW build.

 

[Budnicks]

Unless the "eye candy" effect is a factor. For me, that's part of it, but I want to "honor" the "V-code" aspect of my Roadrunner, thus my decision to try 3x2 of "something" as long as possible.

sorry @LemonWedge Wedge, not trying to hi-jack your build thread

STR-14-6 Edelbrock for me worked the best, of the 6bbls
easier to tune (didn't pick up much at all thou)
it had all the MoPar Tom Hoover Bulletin/Bible Mods/jetting done to it

the single 4500 Dominator top worked well too,
just couldn't get the fine-tuning down on the street at that time
way back when sometime before 1985-ish

not my photo it's from the -www-

other than a Arlen Vanke modded dual-plane 'cut the top center divider/s down'
& use a 1" phenolic spacers
on the Edelbrock 1969.5 6bbl aluminum intake

the Wieand tunnel/cross-ram '6bbl top' was a tuning problem,
(they just had an Engine Masters episode, just this week.
That they had the exact same types of problems I had tunning, jetts too)
& I didn't have a dyno, I was going by seat-of-the-pants, out on beat runs
& guys I had known, who ran them advice
It was a lot harder to get started too, or cold starts
not good getting backfire/s
on a big plenum & separated/gasket'd top, type manifold
it worked well 'at wide open throttle', but not driving around on the street


please carry on with @LemonWedge build

 

[LemonWedge]

No worries at all, Budnicks. A little benchracing should be going on during time spent in the shop building an engine. I’m enjoying the conversation.
Speaking of time spent….. I clearly mis-calculated the PIA factor involved in changing the engine color. Block was hot tanked, no big deal there. But stripping the multiple layers of turquoise from the valve covers, water pump & housing, timing cover, oil pan, is taking WAY longer than I anticipated. Lots of time this weekend spent with the blast cabinet, giving the compressor a workout! Still more to go. It‘s gonna look great though.
Rod Journals were a little looser than I would prefer @ .0035 on a 2.20” journal (This time I’m confident in my measurements). Ordering some -1 bearings for this that I will split. In theory this will leave me at .003.
Also got a call on Friday afternoon from Line2Line. Pistons are done and on their way.

Little by Little we’re picking up speed here.

 

[64fury74charger]

Another outstanding thread with lots of great pictures and details on your project. Thank you for your time and patience to post as your journey continues.

 

[67MPRFAN]

Hey LW . I know the discussion came up before about hood clearance. Here's mine with the Indy intake and 2in carb spacer. FyI hood is not latched

 

[dvw]

Careful sand blasting anything that has baffles. As my machinist say "no better cleaner in the world than hot engine oil".
Doug

 

[LemonWedge]

Hey LW . I know the discussion came up before about hood clearance. Here's mine with the Indy intake and 2in carb spacer. FyI hood is not latched

View attachment 1421576

That’s with a 2” spacer….. so without a spacer just might fit (???).

 

[LemonWedge]

Careful sand blasting anything that has baffles. As my machinist say "no better cleaner in the world than hot engine oil".
Doug

I have been cognoscente of this. The baffles in my valve covers are homemade, installed with sheetmetal screws. I plan on taking them out and bathing and blowing thoroughly. Also Working with walnut shell media, a little easier to clean than sand or glass. Point well received though Doug.

 

[LemonWedge]

Still waiting on the -1 rod bearings from Summit. order has shipped, but UPS is apparently taking their sweet time.

Little by little, more progress to report:
finished all my stripping & blasting work. Got my valvesprings onto the 270 heads. Got the pistons hung on the rods and, and got the rings gapped. Shout out to Line2Line Coatings, as every piston measured identical @ 4.379” (bore is finished @ 4.383”).

When I did the 451, I gapped per “nitrous“ specs, thinking I may add a kit someday. I never did apply any go-go juice, and don’t have any desire to go that direction any time soon. So I’m going with a tighter N/A setting this time around. Currently, we’re set at .021 gap at the top ring and .023 2nd.

 

[LemonWedge]

I’ve watched every youtube video I can find. Anyone care to share their way of achieving proper clearance with a nylon cam button and a stock timing cover?

Ive got the button to fit,had to relieve it slightly to work around the cam bolts. I’ve got it so I’m just flush with timing cover, but having a tough time envisioning how to measure the clearance from here. I guess blue plastiguage will make it pretty easy (?). What say you?