LemonWedge 470 build thread

[68 HEMI GTS]

I’ve been Gathering parts and plan on having things to the machine shop here soon. I’m now looking at heads and have mede the decision to invest in a set of TF270’s. So I’ll need to tackle the B-series MW intake dilemma. How good is the Indy intake? How tall is it? Would I be better off with that or re-working my current M1? Trickflow says their intake seals to the 270 heads and can be ported to fit them…. Is that a better option than the Indy? If I went that direction I’m sure I would inherit hood clearance issues, which means investing in a glass hood and scoop since I’m not going to cut my flawless factory hood. Lots to consider.

I’m sure this topic has been beat to death elsewhere, but please weigh in with your opinion.

BTW: My CNC’d Stealths, along with a few other items will be for sale if anyone is interested…. I’ll post them up in the ads section as soon as they’re availabl.

View attachment 1339640

Indy single plane is a great intake with the 4150 flange. The 4500 version is a little funky. That said I ran a 4150 with a 4500 adaptor on my roadrunner steet car for a bit. Thing was awesome, by far the best intake/carb combo I’ve had on it. The intake was ported M/W size. I also built the carb, ( one reason it worked so well on the street). Didnt have the normal dominator to fat to cruise calibration. It would be my choice for all out performance street or strip. That was on a 400/512. I actually have that intake on my dads car right now instead of the 4500 version. I may send the 4500 one to Wilson. M1 is a viable option. I’d spend the money to have it ported by Wilson as well if that’s the route you choose. It’ll be down on power from a ported Indy though. Andy F’s 470 build had a lot of good info on it as far as the intake.

And yes I’m a dominator guy, don’t get me wrong. I’ve built some really good running 4150’s. I just think the dominators make more power. And they can drive around just as good as a 4150 if built correct.

 

[67MPRFAN]

Andy just posted this over on moparts

 

[LemonWedge]

Finally did the teardown of the 451 today. I was really happy with what I found. The head gasket breach was as expected, but there is very little, if any, damage to the head. A simple surfacing will take care of it, and these heads will then be up for sale.
The pan was clear of anything alarming. I think the rod bearings look great for 13 years / roughly 1000 runs at 6500 RPM with my trusty routine of one oil change a year. Haven’t pulled the crank just yet, but hopefully they look similar. The cylinder walls look great with no lip or scoring. A torque-Plate honing and they should be good to go. The pistons look good too, which is key because they will be re-used. The timing chain looks great with no slack at all, I’ll likely re-use that set as well.
Ill be ordering the heads this week and with any luck I’ll get the short block components to the machine shop.

 

[Tex013]

I’ve been Gathering parts and plan on having things to the machine shop here soon. I’m now looking at heads and have mede the decision to invest in a set of TF270’s. So I’ll need to tackle the B-series MW intake dilemma. How good is the Indy intake? How tall is it? Would I be better off with that or re-working my current M1? Trickflow says their intake seals to the 270 heads and can be ported to fit them…. Is that a better option than the Indy? If I went that direction I’m sure I would inherit hood clearance issues, which means investing in a glass hood and scoop since I’m not going to cut my flawless factory hood. Lots to consider.

I’m sure this topic has been beat to death elsewhere, but please weigh in with your opinion.

BTW: My CNC’d Stealths, along with a few other items will be for sale if anyone is interested…. I’ll post them up in the ads section as soon as they’re availabl.

View attachment 1339640

You wont regret the TF270 heads . From all i've read the TF intake will not open up to max wedge without welding I think like your M1 . Dont forget the TF270 is a raised intake port head . I also used the TF plate with removable centre , I have a RB .

Tex

 

[biomedtechguy]

You wont regret the TF270 heads . From all i've read the TF intake will not open up to max wedge without welding I think like your M1 . Dont forget the TF270 is a raised intake port head . I also used the TF plate with removable centre , I have a RB .
Tex

@LemonWedge and @Tex013 and @andyf
If you don't mind a question:
With the TF 270s and an intake CNC'd to Max Wedge port size, what components make up the "ideal" valley plate configuration for mostly street and highway cruising, but ALSO some rather serious trips down the 1320??
Does @andyf AR "batwing" play a vital role? I know he makes one specifically for Max Wedge port TF 270s. Can y'all shed some light and list some part numbers? The time to order those parts is rapidly approaching. Thanks

 

[LemonWedge]

@LemonWedge and @Tex013 and @andyf
If you don't mind a question:
With the TF 270s and an intake CNC'd to Max Wedge port size, what components make up the "ideal" valley plate configuration for mostly street and highway cruising, but ALSO some rather serious trips down the 1320??
Does @andyf AR "batwing" play a vital role? I know he makes one specifically for Max Wedge port TF 270s. Can y'all shed some light and list some part numbers? The time to order those parts is rapidly approaching. Thanks

I’m not exactly sure just yet, but I do know that before long I’ll be able to report whether or not the 440 Source valley pan works adequately, as I have one of those on the way along with the 270’s At this point.

 

[Tex013]

@LemonWedge and @Tex013 and @andyf
If you don't mind a question:
With the TF 270s and an intake CNC'd to Max Wedge port size, what components make up the "ideal" valley plate configuration for mostly street and highway cruising, but ALSO some rather serious trips down the 1320??
Does @andyf AR "batwing" play a vital role? I know he makes one specifically for Max Wedge port TF 270s. Can y'all shed some light and list some part numbers? The time to order those parts is rapidly approaching. Thanks

biomed ,
With my TF270s the port sit out over the TF plate so i only used a bead of sealant between head and valley plate . You only use 1 gasket - intake .
I used the TF plate with 440 Source CNC head and used Andy F's batwings as port doesnt quite reach plate .. The batwings are only standard port i think . Also if using them i used a gasket either side , I had Superformance thin intake gaskets . And a bead of sealant across bottom of intake face and plate face where batwing sits .
You can only get the plate off when using TF 270s by pulling a head or maybe both. That is why i bought the one with removable centre for if i need access to lifters or valley .

Tex

 

[67MPRFAN]

I did the same thing. A friend let me borrow his Indy valley plate to mock things up , well I laid some money in his hand added a bead of silicone and bolted the heads down. For intake gaskets I'm also using the Super performance 1's

 

[68 HEMI GTS]

Solid valley plate with removable cover is the best way to go. The TF looks like a nicer piece than the Indy but either will work.

 

[LemonWedge]

I realize now that with the Source pan, I won’t be able to access the lifter valley without pulling a head. I’ll have to think about that, although I can’t remember the last time I needed to access the valley was…….

 

[67MPRFAN]

Usually not necessary. But in my case I like to be able to have access just because

 

[LemonWedge]

TrickFlow MaxWedge goodness…… The 270 heads showed up today. I also accepted the reality of the the Indy Intake pricetag, and ordered one of their 400-I4-2 4150 models up as well. Should be here in a couple days. I have an appointment to sit down with my machinist next week to go over all the details and leave him the pieces. This thing is starting to feel real, and I find myself looking forward to shoving the big yellow car deep into the 10’s next spring.

Is 650hp an attainable goal? If it finds it’s way into that range, I should be able to be somewhere around 10.50, and push somewhere near 130mph.

 

[68 HEMI GTS]

I realize now that with the Source pan, I won’t be able to access the lifter valley without pulling a head. I’ll have to think about that, although I can’t remember the last time I needed to access the valley was…….

If you go with a roller you will need that option for lifter maintenance.

 

[dvw]

Not sure on TF heads. But with -1s you can slide an Indy valley pan out with the heads still in place. Slide it back and drop it into the valley. The worst part is breaking the RTV loose at the china walls. I tapped the center mounting holes in the end of the plate to 3/8x24. Then you can screw a bolt into the plate to lift it slightly. A razor knife can now slice between the block and plate. Slice between the head and plate. Then it will come out.
Doug

 

[stage3]

TrickFlow MaxWedge goodness…… The 270 heads showed up today. I also accepted the reality of the the Indy Intake pricetag, and ordered one of their 400-I4-2 4150 models up as well. Should be here in a couple days. I have an appointment to sit down with my machinist next week to go over all the details and leave him the pieces. This thing is starting to feel real, and I find myself looking forward to shoving the big yellow car deep into the 10’s next spring.

Is 650hp an attainable goal? If it finds it’s way into that range, I should be able to be somewhere around 10.50, and push somewhere near 130mph.

View attachment 1342903

View attachment 1342904

looks like christmas morning !! with those heads flowing north of 350 they r ""capable"" of alot more than 650.

 

[69sunfireGTX]

Where did you get the 270's from? Thought they were still on backorder?

 

[Tex013]

TrickFlow MaxWedge goodness…… The 270 heads showed up today. I also accepted the reality of the the Indy Intake pricetag, and ordered one of their 400-I4-2 4150 models up as well. Should be here in a couple days. I have an appointment to sit down with my machinist next week to go over all the details and leave him the pieces. This thing is starting to feel real, and I find myself looking forward to shoving the big yellow car deep into the 10’s next spring.

Is 650hp an attainable goal? If it finds it’s way into that range, I should be able to be somewhere around 10.50, and push somewhere near 130mph.

View attachment 1342903

View attachment 1342904

650 is quite doable , I am a bit over that using a ft cam , pump gas , street exhaust . Been mid 10.20s @ 130 .Normally 10.30s . I am using a 4500 (1050) carb . 3790lbs on start line , last race meet

Tex

 

[LemonWedge]

Where did you get the 270's from? Thought they were still on backorder?

440 source has them. They only stock the “hyd. Roller” version, but the only difference is the springs, and I’m swapping them out for the springs spec’d by Howard’s to match my cam anyway, so no problem.

 

[LemonWedge]

650 is quite doable , I am a bit over that using a ft cam , pump gas , street exhaust . Been mid 10.20s @ 130 .Normally 10.30s . I am using a 4500 (1050) carb . 3790lbs on start line , last race meet

Tex

Wow…. I’m at 11:1 & 3700 with a decent sized solid roller and an annular 1000cfm 4150. This thing may surprise me.

 

[Tex013]

Wow…. I’m at 11:1 with a decent sized solid roller and a 1000cfm 4150. This thing may surprise me.

yes Im at 11.0:1 comp , .600 nett lift . Dont forget Im at 505ci so a few more cubes . But most would say Im leaving HP on the table by not using a solid roller . I shift @ 6500 trap 6700ish .
Same bottom end with Source CNC heads and 4150 carb went 10.50@126ish . So that was about what i expected to gain .25 ET . Expensive upgrade though . That will give you an idea of your potential gains .

Tex